Mafia 1 - The CROWN - GAME OVER!

[Clemens]

I find it unlikely that the first target of infected mafia kill was Pelasgi. Unless Pelasgi was a known middle-of-the-pack veteran name?... It's hard for me to quickly check what various people wrote about Pelasgi throughout the days, but my impression is that Pelasgi is not a household name. I understand that targeting someone like Radwulf is too dangerous on Night 1. But the mafia team ought to be able to identify an average veteran who would be known to be smart, expected to be reliably active, and certainly worth being murdered.

I can only offer you theories.
Going for more obscure targets is safer.
Testing out your killing method, if you are not given the full scope of information, may be safer on someone who is unlikely going to be watched at the beginning. More so with a "slow kill" like this, where the victim has a chance to stick around against you.
Or Pelasgi was someone with interest/relevance to someone on the Mafia side.

It is very convenient that no doctor will ever be able to confirm what happened to you. And no mafia will obviously confirm that you were targeted.

Quite the opposite, it is greatly inconvenient to me. I cannot prove anything and Mafia will be very eager to kill me off during the day since their virus does not work. At the same time, a vigilante could still kill me at night if they don't believe me.
I also don't have much information to contribute.
Which is precisely why I was hoping to see someone other than you attack me to profit from my role before exposed.
Now the only point of my exposure is that someone may have observed something during N1.

What is your NTA?

I have no NTA, hence I am always in my room at night, hence I find it strange that you can just waltz in undetected to collect samples.
So if you can do that, how many more can as well?

Perhaps you are a test subject, too?

Not in the original sense of the term.
I am a Researcher that went into the field of microbiology for the sole purpose of curing my own chronic infection, subjecting myself to various vaccines and cures. As a consequence, I am now left with a self-inflicted hyper-active immune system which comes with other health-related downsides.
To add some fluff, I did experience the symptoms of the corona infection and physically suffered from it shortly hence I know it happened, but my body fought off the infection quickly. (N1 event.)

- There might be some players who get converted into mafia instead of dying next day

Even as a neutral, I did not believe that to be the case. Which is why I would have voted for Radwulf myself (perhaps not in the last minutes of the day, though) who was vehemently trying to go with a zombie-theme. I am inclined to believe that Corona kills people.
However, I am immune to viral infections so I would be immune to zombie-coronavirus just the same.

Perhaps all mafia players have an increased temperature, and Nurse could detect that. It seems that getting food poisoning also increases your temperature (Radwulf claimed joesatri's temperature was higher than normal).

I would assume so, since "Infected Gardner" (I still think he may have been guilty, just from the role name itself) implies an infection in the name.
Food poisoning could also give you a false positive from how bodies and temperature work.
Actually being infected (with impending death) likely does have a higher temperature.
And to add another bit of fluff, one of my health-related downsides is an elevated temperature as well.
Which is why I said Radwulf misunderstood his role and NTA; on the other hand you have a better grasp of your own - it gives you circumstancial information, not straight Mafia. (If you are being truthful.)

[valli]

We know that Adela was Bio-warfare Researcher. Her role name does not indicate she was infected, so it's safe to assume she was not a part of mafia.

I am unsure about your analysis bio-warfare does not sound that good and would fit a crafted corona virus which could be weapponized ... therefore I tend to say that Adela was mafia.

[Clemens]

I am unsure about your analysis bio-warfare does not sound that good and would fit a crafted corona virus which could be weapponized ... therefore I tend to say that Adela was mafia.

Bio-warfare sounds sinister, but Radwulf said she had a normal temperature.
And the "Infected" part of "Infected Gardner" is very striking.

On that note, what do you think about SilveXtru then?

[Gridfon]

@joesatri said:

Because I got infected by the cleaning and maintenance department last night. 
Fever DOES NOT MEAN mafia. 

I don't think fever has anything to do with poisoned food, at least that's what he says.

Yeah, you are right, I confused the two things. The post you quoted concerns a different topic (that fever does not imply mafia), but you are right nonetheless. Here is a better quote that explains your point:

Regarding events you shared, i obviously thought that N1 feeling unwell and N2 getting the virus are related. Makes sense. However, I asked for clarification, and i got an answer, that the two events are not related.

Regarding the "how the hell can Joe know that is temperature is elevated" - that's because i was informed of it, and that I will DIE at the end of the day!

---

@Gridfon you role name is just Researcher?

Yes.

[Gridfon]

@joesatri said:

Because I got infected by the cleaning and maintenance department last night. 
Fever DOES NOT MEAN mafia. 

I don't think fever has anything to do with poisoned food, at least that's what he says.

Yeah, you are right, I confused the two things. The post you quoted concerns a different topic (that fever does not imply mafia), but you are right nonetheless. Here is a better quote that explains your point:

Regarding events you shared, i obviously thought that N1 feeling unwell and N2 getting the virus are related. Makes sense. However, I asked for clarification, and i got an answer, that the two events are not related.

Regarding the "how the hell can Joe know that is temperature is elevated" - that's because i was informed of it, and that I will DIE at the end of the day!

And this means that I'll go back to the drawing board and give MrWaffles some benefit of the doubt.

[valli]

I am unsure about your analysis bio-warfare does not sound that good and would fit a crafted corona virus which could be weapponized ... therefore I tend to say that Adela was mafia.

Bio-warfare sounds sinister, but Radwulf said she had a normal temperature.
And the "Infected" part of "Infected Gardner" is very striking.

On that note, what do you think about SilveXtru then?

yeah being mad after bio weappons does not necessary mean that you need to be infected.

Concerning SilveXtru, that actually is confusing me, as everyon, besides you, died so far from the infection. Having infected in the role name therefore means there is yet another thing to being infected then we know ... could it be the "one" thingie infection?

[Emilly]

vote Nanaa can help declare the role

[Nanaa]

I can declare my role if at least 7 thinks it's necessary.
So far 4 ppl voted for me:
Gridfon
phox
Skuggi
Emilly

(I'll try to check tomorrow morning)

[Gridfon]

<snip>

I'm the facility manager. Due to the limited supplies, I only approve of our supply usage when I find it absolutely necessary. I don't have high regards about myself, so I can't target myself.

<snip>

I always assumed I had the doctor role in this game. That the limited supplies referred to our medicines. And that I only distribute them when it's life or dead. That would have also explained why I can't target myself.

My target in N2 was Joe and in N3 it was Clemens. I don't get any intel back.

<snip>

Since Joe had food poisoning the night I targeted him and that still happened, that confirmed my idea of my doctor role. Cause the food poisoning doesn't kill, so I wouldn't hand out our precious supplies (meds). This is also why I thought that the fever was not the cause of death. Hence why I also believe that Joe got targeted in N1 and Princess in N2. If he was targeted in N1 and I checked his supplies in N2, the virus would be too advanced for the meds to help. So I wouldn't give them.

In the bolded part, can you elaborate on what happened? I read it multiple times, and I do not understand why you thought you were the doctor at the time. The first of the bolded sentences, in particular, seems to make the same mistake as the one I just made above - misremembering the day when Joesatri had food poisoning. It was on Day 1 (see joesatri's #31 and MrWaffles' #1050).

[Gridfon]

I can declare my role if at least 7 thinks it's necessary.
So far 4 ppl voted for me:
Gridfon
phox
Skuggi
Emilly

(I'll try to check tomorrow morning)

7 votes was an arbitrary requirement set by MrWaffles, to gauge everyone's interest in declaring his role. The original rule Daemon stated before the game required 50% of deadline-lynch required votes to be able to declare (that would be 50% of 7 votes = around 4 votes today). According to someone's request, Daemon dropped this rule prior to the start of the game: you won't find any requirement to declare your role on Page 1 of this thread. We have been declaring roles without requiring any votes first (see: Princess.ruxi and myself).

It is up to you to choose when you will declare your role. Just make sure to understand it's your own decision, and you won't be able to use the excuse along the lines of: "I really wanted to declare, but rules prevented me to, then I had to go AFK for the last 2 days, and I ran out of time".

[Gridfon]

@Princess.ruxi on night 3 i hung around Grifon's room. nobody visited him. To think, i thought about hanging around your room too!!!! but shoulda woulda coulda doesn't help anyone

I cannot seem to find this yet, and I don't recall whether you ever posted this: who did you investigate on Night 2?

[Mary]

As I said earlier, I'd put my vote where its most useful - unvote blissie and vote nanaa, to help get the ball rolling , as blissie hasn't said anything all day.

@Clemens , if what you're saying is true, it sounds like your hyper active immune system is another variation on how the virus affects people.

I also have very distinct physiology, making it valuable for vaccine research and I'm I also isolated in my room, with a one off NTA that involves typing on a keyboard.
The difference is that I have this connection to EC.

The fact that I declared all of this earlier makes me think of two options: our roles just have some overlap (I imagine it's probably quite hard to come up with 28 different ones to be fair) or you drew some inspiration from my role. I haven't made my mind up yet about how much suspicion to attribute to that but I'm sure the rest of the day will help with that. Just struck me as interesting.

[Gridfon]

Perhaps all mafia players have an increased temperature, and Nurse could detect that. It seems that getting food poisoning also increases your temperature (Radwulf claimed joesatri's temperature was higher than normal).

I would assume so, since "Infected Gardner" (I still think he may have been guilty, just from the role name itself) implies an infection in the name.
Food poisoning could also give you a false positive from how bodies and temperature work.
Actually being infected (with impending death) likely does have a higher temperature.
And to add another bit of fluff, one of my health-related downsides is an elevated temperature as well.
Which is why I said Radwulf misunderstood his role and NTA; on the other hand you have a better grasp of your own - it gives you circumstancial information, not straight Mafia. (If you are being truthful.)

Do note that I misled you with my claim that food poisoning increases one's temperature. :p

I am unsure about your analysis bio-warfare does not sound that good and would fit a crafted corona virus which could be weapponized ... therefore I tend to say that Adela was mafia.

That is extremely unlikely, as that would unnecessarily mislead everyone about the game mechanics. Bio-Warfare Researcher could have been a Vigilante, or a Psycho. If it was a mafia member, the name would likely say "Infected Bio-Warfare Researcher".

Concerning SilveXtru, that actually is confusing me, as everyon, besides you, died so far from the infection. Having infected in the role name therefore means there is yet another thing to being infected then we know ... could it be the "one" thingie infection?

I assume that all mafia member roles are called "Infected X" for different choices of X.

[valli]

yes possible, that it is a psycho / vigilante role and mafia has fhe infected X part

[Nanaa]

Okay @Gridfon. Since 7 votes was just an arbitrary amount set by MrWaffless and my role isn't useful early game, I fine declaring it with 5 votes on me:

My Role:
Conspiracy Theorist
I infiltrated CROWN to investigate what was going on there and especially what have the Chinese been doing there. I have no NTA. Also there was a hint that at some point in the game (if we get there) I'll gain something if I'm still alive. I believe this "point" could be a certain day reached or a certain event occurred which would make my conspiracy research's puzzle pieces snap together and reveal me something.

[EscapedConvict]

Hi @EscapedConvict,

Sorry if I am digging too deep into mechanics you don't know about, but how can Mary go into cryofreeze if you go into cryofreeze? I thought the story said that cryofreeze is not the same as death ("community was one of scholars, not of murderers"). If we lynch you, we put you in a freezer which we will later thaw you out from (I guess after the game ends). As we didn't put Mary in the freezer, does she just actually die because her heart stops beating without being in a freezer?

Regardless of the above, I am still happy to freeze you, because if Mary is evil, you will be cryofrozen (and maybe alive at game end or whatever), while she will die. I am still very unhappy with lynching Mary first just in case you are lying, because that costs us (innocent) Mary to kill (guilty) EscapedConvict.

However, I can switch my vote to her if someone can convince me that the link you share with her is now broken and my strategy will kill (innocent) EscapedConvict without killing (guilty) Mary. Given all the things that have to be proven (or at least supported) for me to switch my vote, I feel EscapedConvict would have an easier time just having people vote for himself instead. We can still lynch Mary after EscapedConvict, especially if his role is not revealed as Infected after he gets frozen.

-MrWaffles

Possibly. I just know she dies if I do.

The whole cry-stasis thingy is just game color (fluff) imo, cryo-stais = death as far as I'm concerned.

Also, Daemon never responded to the email from yesterday.

The answer from Daemon arrived, of course in riddle form but pretty descipherable I'd say

The gist of it: since me and @Mary are mirror twins (connected to the last atom) the.mod hinted to the fact that I shoild know if a disconnect happened or when it happens.
Again he wasn't definitive and clear in his answer but I see no other way to interpret what he said.
The only question that remains is how would I find out?
Would he , the moderator inform me via email or is there another riddle somewhere else in the game I have to solve

So having said that as of right now I am not aware of @Mary disconnecting from me so if I die she dies too and vice versa.

My vote stays on myself and its up to the majority to decide the course of action next.
I'd like to live longer and contribute what I can but I have a nagging feeling @Mary should be dispatched of today. We shouldn't delay any longer.

[Noni]

@Princess.ruxi on night 3 i hung around Grifon's room. nobody visited him. To think, i thought about hanging around your room too!!!! but shoulda woulda coulda doesn't help anyone

I cannot seem to find this yet, and I don't recall whether you ever posted this: who did you investigate on Night 2?

1.radwulf
2 Behemoth
3 Gridfon

[Emilly]

unvote Nanaa for now

For me they are suspicious:

@Sander because I did not understand his role, some connections with other games, players who know each other, and as a suicide ... it seems to me something invented ... possibly a psycho.
The second suspect seems to me to be @Gridfon because the name of the role and I have the impression that the 3 NTAs are invented. Clemens is not infected.

And we still have players who are suspicious of being silent from the beginning.
@MrWaffles will have to play by our rules from now on and if he doesn't block what he's told ... lynch.

@EscapedConvict you remind me of radwulf when you insisted he should be killed immediately. And he prayed to leave him for at least another night. I told you it's not a mafia, but you seem to be ignoring everything that doesn't suit you. I also suggested that Mary live another night and we investigate her. If she's a mafia, she dies tomorrow morning with or without his twin brother. I don't understand why are you in such a hurry.
I've read Blissie's posts before: he voted for Moxy, Radwulf and Trigardon. And shut up. He is going to appear at the end of the day and cast a vote on anyone just to have someone die and not be eliminated.

vote blissie

[Sander]

@Sander your role is "suicidal"? Do you have a hammer?

You should definitely Lynch me. My play style has made it to easy for people to hide behind me and even do it legit. Suicide has nothing to do with my role, just my personality. Though, you will regret lynching me town number wise. I won't commit suicide anymore because I've been pointed out that any clues would die with me than, and I don't want any clues to disappear. For those who suggest, it was all part of a master plan, thank you for thinking so high of me.

I just read the comments and I felt the urge to try and by useful again.
I think radwulf measured whether a person had been targeted by something malicious.
Joe had food poisoning in N1 and his temperature was higher than normal in N2. That makes sense. Cause my food poisoning says I have a fever. It would be logical that after my "non voting" is cured, I would be able to participate but still have an higher than normal temperature. It follows the routine of, I was sick but I'm recovering and so I can start participating again, slowly. For this theory to work Waffles would be mafia. Unless of course. That Radwulf had only the purpose of being a back up doctor, and thus his current NTA may also just be to check, whether someone is speaking the truth or not. Someone can't claim he hadn't been targeted in the previous night because radwulf would notice it. And radwulf would be able to check whether a person was telling the truth, in the next night. That doesn't seem like a to important role when you are the back up doctor, but stil useful and a fun extra NTA nevertheless.

Now, I targeted Joe in N2. And yet he still died. This still makes me believe the virus was infected in him on N1, therefor I could not save him with meds, since he was to far gone. Do remember in N2 we had a brutal murder. It would make sense, that I can't heal that, since no meds can save an open skull. And it would also not make sense, that there are two types of killings that I can't heal. Thus it might still be possible that Princess got targeted in N2 and is getting the message now. That means, tomorrow we will find out who got targeted in N3.
Another possibility is that the mafia targeted Joe in N2, and was successful because I got deflected to another room. I deem it highly possible we have such a role amongst us. Especially because Daemon talks about it in the mechanics of this game. If that is true, the victim of N1 is still unknown even though Clemens claims to be it. I don't see it fit that there would be a townie, immune to Mafia.

So what could explain N1 without a kill. Perhaps the mafia has also some kind of blocker and he might have been deflected as well. I don't know. Wild guess and seems unlikely. More likely is that Clemens his ancestor had a more to do with that. Two people were going to get kicked due to inactivity. Daemon had to made a deliberate choice. Though Adela does not sound town to me, we haven't lynched a mafia, and we already have an infected player that withdraws. If the infected player is mafia, it would be painful for mafia to lose two players like that. One by withdrawal and the other by inactivity. In our previous days, we already walked the path that the first night might not have had a kill due to inactivity. If Pelasgi (Clemens) was indeed inactive and The Godfather he did not state who to kill and the night got lost. Chances are high, Daemon found that unfair and had to intervene. Saying that any one of the mafia could send in the target. Without consent of The Godfather. Therefor N2 Joe and N3 Princess.

Next section is based on a previous games but is mainly the reason why I think Clemens is mafia above being mafia immune. I do not know whether it makes a lot of sense but still. In a previous game from Daemon, I could go into rooms to check whether there was equipment present. There were only two parties without equipment, people without NTA and The Godfather. None of the equipment said anything about their role or whether they were Mafia or Townie, only what they had. If we were to follow that logic, being autoimmune to viruses, would be very Godfather like. Because that would mean that every reading would come negative. So not a single result would mean anything. However Gridfon his readings could be more accurate, cause he doesn't measure Clemens himself but the room. Though it's uncertain what he measures exactly, and what the cleaning has to do with it. Except that it disrupts the reading. If of course his ability exists.

[Clemens]

I'm I also isolated in my room

I am not isolated in my room, I just have no reason to go outside at night.

@Clemens , if what you're saying is true, it sounds like your hyper active immune system is another variation on how the virus affects people.

I've had this unusual immune system before this entire ordreal, albeit with side-effects.

Do note that I misled you with my claim that food poisoning increases one's temperature. :p

I am aware, but it depends on how much real world influence comes from outside of this base. :p
Speaking of, it was @Sander that tried to argue the point that other factors could also cause higher temperatures, like using physical NTAs.

Bio-Warfare Researcher could have been a Vigilante, or a Psycho.

yes possible, that it is a psycho / vigilante role and mafia has fhe infected X part

Don't you two forget about the hammer.

[phox]

oufff this has been a lot to follow. @Nanaa thanks for answering my question. for now unvote Nanaa.

@Clemens and @Gridfon since you guys have been active all day long coming with different interesting theories, what do you think about Nanna's role? the conspiracy theorist.

@Blissie you are stretching our patience to the limit with your ghost mode , come join us , will ya' ?
vote Blissie .
If there is one thing I've learned from the past days, is that we need to be more productive and get more info, we can't wait an eternity until someone decides to show up or not.

[Emilly]

@Sander you could be a writer. Thanks for the clarification. I dont want to lynch you, I just wanted to understand.
And I understand you suspect Clemens is the Godfather? In this case, if we use our NTA, he would be clean, not infected.

[phox]

@Telvek are you just gonna vote for @Noni without a logical reason and then disappear for the rest of the day?
Is this a lame attempt to contribute to the game? Seems like you just wanna avoid being kicked out of the game for not posting, while you do your sneaky evil business during the night.

[phox]

Ok tomorrow is our last day which means we don't have much time left. So we need to deal with some of the inactives and fishy ones: @Blissie, @Telvek , @Behemoth .

We can put the @EC and @Mary thing on hold until we deal with the ones mentioned above and figure out what to do with @Sander ... not sure I want EC to die yet, we need voting power for the townies and if Mary says she is innocent, then she would have to prove it by not voting against town wishes. otherwise => lynch also I like what @Emilly is saying about investigating mary to find out the truth rather than only relying on EC's word.

@behemoth you said you were gonna contribute, did you change your mind?

[Clemens]

@Sander voted to kill off joesatri, along with Radwulf (turned out innocent), Siderite, and zero (who withdrew) - consequentially removing any clues his infection death would have brought.
Then once the day was nearing its end, he gave up on joesatri and piled on the final vote onto Radwulf to kill.
So unless someone has something of value to spice up the action again, my vote will have to remain on him.
The problem with the silent and/or inactive players is that you either threaten them with an insta-lynch or you're just wasting a lot of time waiting for them to react. I'm not up for voting on inactives until we agree to actually make the threat real.

This still makes me believe the virus was infected in him on N1 [...] Thus it might still be possible that Princess got targeted in N2 and is getting the message now. [...] the victim of N1 is still unknown even though Clemens claims to be it.

That means you don't believe me, simply put.
And if you could vote, you would vote for me?
Now tell me, why is it so important to you to convince everyone that there is a 2-day dying period instead of a 1-day dying period?

immune to Mafia

I'm not, I'm specifically immune to viral infections.
I do believe that is their main way to kill at night, but I am far from immortal.
The trade-off is that I have no NTA whatsoever.

Two people were going to get kicked due to inactivity. Daemon had to made a deliberate choice. Though Adela does not sound town to me, we haven't lynched a mafia, and we already have an infected player that withdraws. If the infected player is mafia, it would be painful for mafia to lose two players like that. One by withdrawal and the other by inactivity.

If you want to attempt to meta-game it, let me counter meta-game it.
We had 28 players total. 1/3rd is ~9 Mafia. +/- perhaps 1 for reasons. 3 dead security, presumably innocent. 1 dead nurse, also presumably innocent. 1 dead computer expert, almost certainly innocent. That would equal to 5 dead innocents. That leaves 23 other players, with ~9 being Mafia, we're down to 14 innocents. Since "Infected Gardner" and "Bio-Warefare Researcher" are uncertainties, if we add them to the innocent side we're down to 12:9. I personally don't believe they're both innocent, so I'd correct the ratio to 13:8. If you were inclined to believe they are both guilty, that's 14:7. In a game as big as this, I would expect a third faction (even if it's as small as a single psycho). So we've got either 12:8:1 or 13:7:1, or even less innocents if there are more neutrals out there. With ratios like these, I dare say it is more likely to even out the balance in favor of the innocents than the guilty. How is that for meta-gaming?
Regardless, I wouldn't put much stock in meta-game theories; inactive players harm the game one way or another and force mods to come up with a solution that tends to influence the game one way or another.

If we were to follow that logic, being autoimmune to viruses, would be very Godfather like. Because that would mean that every reading would come negative. [...]
However Gridfon his readings could be more accurate, cause he doesn't measure Clemens himself but the room.

The Godfather wouldn't have to be immune to the virus as no one would even attempt to infect him.
I at least understand what you mean by the Godfather's room being guilty rather than the Godfather himself - you're suggesting that @Gridfon's ability circumvents the Godfather's cop-immunity by indirectly testing.
There is really nothing I can say about that.
And Radwulf is dead so he can't check my elevated temperature directly; do you remember who had the final vote to kill him?

[Clemens]

Okay @Gridfon. Since 7 votes was just an arbitrary amount set by MrWaffless and my role isn't useful early game, I fine declaring it with 5 votes on me:

My Role:
Conspiracy Theorist
I infiltrated CROWN to investigate what was going on there and especially what have the Chinese been doing there. I have no NTA. Also there was a hint that at some point in the game (if we get there) I'll gain something if I'm still alive. I believe this "point" could be a certain day reached or a certain event occurred which would make my conspiracy research's puzzle pieces snap together and reveal me something.

Honestly? I don't buy it at all.
We're in the middle of nowhere, the north pole.
This place is not easily accessible, and how exactly do you "infiltrate" anyway?
He's known personel with his own room and everything (since I assume he can be targeted at night).
"Conspiracy Theorist" is not a job that any scientific facility would require or hire.
Now, if he had claimed he was a facility employee of some sort (his actual job for which he was hired at this high-security and vitally important CROWN base) and does conspiracy theories on the side I could give him the benefit of doubt.
And then he's specifically here to investigate the Chinese (lots of that in the intro)?
From my understanding, our research here is not exactly common knowledge, so where did he even pick up on these "chinese ongoings"?
According to the intro, our first in-game "day" started at the same time as China delivered their first official report about Wuhan.
So when would he even have been able to get in? And why has security not prevented or kicked him out way before?
I also appreciate how he calls it "conspiracy research". It also reads as "Don't kill me, I'll eventually have very useful information! Yes yes!"
The fluff, the purpose, and the possible gameplay from his claim does not make sense to me.

The only point I can accept is that with so many players, Daemon may have had to come up with some unusual filler roles.

[phox]

@Sander is obviously bad. Why else would he threaten to commit suicide? And say we would never get him out alive?

I say we should do this: the town should seriously start voting for the inactives, and we should nudge them together one by one to get more info, blissie, telvek, behemoth and bombaclaat (I almost forgot about him). and as a backup we have sander who we know is fishy and needs to go soon, and as a backup to the backup we have mary and EC (as voting options for this day)

Hopefully we can get some substantial info before the day ends, but we need votes for that, so come on people, I'm only asking for nudges @zero @EscapedConvict @Noni @Mary @valli @Heffie @Rene @Skuggi let's help our inactives get back into the game

The nudge worked with @Nanaa ( btw @Gridfon you didn't tell me your thoughts on her role)

[Clemens]

Uh, the above was meant to be a reply to this as well:

@Clemens and @Gridfon since you guys have been active all day long coming with different interesting theories, what do you think about Nanna's role? the conspiracy theorist.

[Clemens]

@Sander is obviously bad. Why else would he threaten to commit suicide? And say we would never get him out alive?

I would not put much focus into that. He's known for being theatrical and dramatic.
He likes to confuse and be cryptic; a trait that works well to cause distractions when you are indeed guilty.

The nudge worked with @Nanaa ( btw @Clemens you didn't tell me your thoughts on her role @Gridfon too)

I did, it just took me longer than I'd have liked because I had to keep re-checking Daemon's bloody long introductions.

[phox]

@Sander is obviously bad. Why else would he threaten to commit suicide? And say we would never get him out alive?

I would not put much focus into that. He's known for being theatrical and dramatic.
He likes to confuse and be cryptic; a trait that works well to cause distractions when you are indeed guilty.

The nudge worked with @Nanaa ( btw @Clemens you didn't tell me your thoughts on her role @Gridfon too)

I did, it just took me longer than I'd have liked because I had to keep re-checking Daemon's bloody long introductions.

yeah I think the role is fishy too, maybe @Nanaa could provide more info that does not sound so made up ?
It could be that daemon just needed a filler role and gave it a sophisticated name, this theory doesn't sound impossible to me @Clemens

[Rene]

Anyone keeping tabs on current vote numbers?

So I don't suspect nor trust you @blissie, but it'd be nice to know more about you. I'll revoke my vote just as easily, I promise.

vote blissie

[phox]

@Rene
Not sure about this but these are some of the votes I remember
Votes:
- 4 votes on Sander: Gridfon, Clemens, Princess.ruxi, valli
- 3 votes on blissie by : Emily, Phox, Rene
- 1 vote on noni by : Telvek
- 1 vote on clemens : by Heffie
- 3 on Mary (?): Skuggi, EscapedConvict (?), zero
- 1 or 2 on EC: Mrwaffles, EC (?)
And some votes on Nanna? By Mary and idk

[Mary]

@Sander is obviously bad. Why else would he threaten to commit suicide? And say we would never get him out alive?

I say we should do this: the town should seriously start voting for the inactives, and we should nudge them together one by one to get more info, blissie, telvek, behemoth and bombaclaat (I almost forgot about him). and as a backup we have sander who we know is fishy and needs to go soon, and as a backup to the backup we have mary and EC (as voting options for this day)

Hopefully we can get some substantial info before the day ends, but we need votes for that, so come on people, I'm only asking for nudges @zero @EscapedConvict @Noni @Mary @valli @Heffie @Rene @Skuggi let's help our inactives get back into the game

The nudge worked with @Nanaa ( btw @Gridfon you didn't tell me your thoughts on her role)

@phox you're the woman with a plan. Great enthusiasm and I hate unhelpful inactive people as much as everyone here, but I think it's unrealistic the town will manage to coax all 4 of the people you mentioned into contributing genuinely. But here's to hoping at least some will change tack.

I'm not sold on @Nanaa 's role since it seems to be lacking purpose but we can mull that over for a while at least. I'll revert back to my original vote and unvote nanaa - >vote blissie but I'm doubtful the nudge will work, since it hasn't on him so far.

As for @Sander, despite Clemens confirming his flair for dramatics, why would anyone say they're removing themselves from the game when the votes are mounting? It's like throwing all your toys out of the pram. So people feel bad, unvote and surprise surprise, there's a reason to carry on playing. Seems a bit off to me.

Edit: forgot to unvote

[behemoth]

@behemoth you said you were gonna contribute, did you change your mind?

Phox - see my posts #1122 and #1124 + I'm on US time zone

My post before I call it a night will follow shortly.

[Siderite]

My Role:
Conspiracy Theorist

Well, isn't that convenient? You are a basically a paranoid gossip in a place where the more you talk, the bigger the chance you get lynched by an even more paranoid mob. When the Fox hears the Rabbit scream he comes a-runnin', but not to help.

[Princess.ruxi]

@EscapedConvict you remind me of radwulf when you insisted he should be killed immediately. And he prayed to leave him for at least another night. I told you it's not a mafia, but you seem to be ignoring everything that doesn't suit you. I also suggested that Mary live another night and we investigate her. If she's a mafia, she dies tomorrow morning with or without his twin brother. I don't understand why are you in such a hurry.

@Emilly if Mary is the Infected Twin / Patient 0, then she will infect another player tonight. That's why is dangerous for her to live another night.

Regarding Mandatory cleaning
I think we got all paranoid in here and now are all conspiracy theorist. I believe it's pretty straight forward and the cleaning is a pro-town ability. It would allow Gridfon to distinguish between real mafia and just townie who was visited by mafia. Test a room - get signs of infection - have a mandatory cleaning - test again (that's usually how it works IRL) - get results. If townie then the results post cleaning would be negative. If Mafia - the result would still be positive.

Regarding Food poisoning / infected

I just read the comments and I felt the urge to try and by useful again.
I think radwulf measured whether a person had been targeted by something malicious.
Joe had food poisoning in N1 and his temperature was higher than normal in N2. That makes sense. Cause my food poisoning says I have a fever. It would be logical that after my "non voting" is cured, I would be able to participate but still have an higher than normal temperature. It follows the routine of, I was sick but I'm recovering and so I can start participating again, slowly. For this theory to work Waffles would be mafia. Unless of course. That Radwulf had only the purpose of being a back up doctor, and thus his current NTA may also just be to check, whether someone is speaking the truth or not. Someone can't claim he hadn't been targeted in the previous night because radwulf would notice it. And radwulf would be able to check whether a person was telling the truth, in the next night. That doesn't seem like a to important role when you are the back up doctor, but stil useful and a fun extra NTA nevertheless.

Now, I targeted Joe in N2. And yet he still died. This still makes me believe the virus was infected in him on N1, therefor I could not save him with meds, since he was to far gone. Do remember in N2 we had a brutal murder. It would make sense, that I can't heal that, since no meds can save an open skull. And it would also not make sense, that there are two types of killings that I can't heal. Thus it might still be possible that Princess got targeted in N2 and is getting the message now. That means, tomorrow we will find out who got targeted in N3.
Another possibility is that the mafia targeted Joe in N2, and was successful because I got deflected to another room. I deem it highly possible we have such a role amongst us. Especially because Daemon talks about it in the mechanics of this game. If that is true, the victim of N1 is still unknown even though Clemens claims to be it. I don't see it fit that there would be a townie, immune to Mafia.

I think you are getting the whole thing with food poisoning and infection all mixed up. Joe had food poisoning on night 1 and was infected on night 2. That's why radwulf's temperature check read higher than normal. He was sick and going to die, just like I am now. I don't like this whole theory about delayed infection, although this is how it works IRL, it would be too confusing if translated into the mechanics of the game.

I am still confused about your role @Sander . If I understood correctly you are dispensing medicine bottles or something like that? How does your NTA work actually?

@Clemens what is the name of your role? I don't remember it.

I say we should do this: the town should seriously start voting for the inactives, and we should nudge them together one by one to get more info, blissie, telvek, behemoth and bombaclaat (I almost forgot about him). and as a backup we have sander who we know is fishy and needs to go soon, and as a backup to the backup we have mary and EC (as voting options for this day)

I agree. vote blissie. Please come forward.
Moving onto telvek and bombaclaat.

Will continue to assert that we should end the day by killing the twins. The risk of Mary infecting another player is too big.

[behemoth]

Re your reasoning about my voting: yes, it's very unfortunate that the 3 people lynched so far were town, but I justified each vote, including the one for radwulf. I said initially that his role sounded legit since it fit so well with the theme of the game, but then his actions were very suspicious and did not stack up! A player having the ability to come with a credible role (especially a player as experienced as radwulf) isn't exonorating, in the end his suspicious game play outweighed that. It's impossible to know who to trust in this game but I trusted Joe, to radwulf's detriment. I went with the logic that seemed most sound at the time and Joe has proved himself trustworthy, albeit in his death.

You seem to forget that 3 people voted much much later in the day to seal radwulf's fate. Forget or choose to ignore that is. Here's a reminder of the other people who voted for radwulf:

Silvextru, blissie, Rene, EC, nanna, valli and sander.

Discount Silvextru and that still leaves 6 people, are you so sure there's a low chance any of them are mafia? You'd only know that if you had insight into who the mafia is, you know, if you were one of them.

It took 9 votes and despite what you're trying to suggest, no, I did not single-handedly 'turn the tide'.

Votes against Radwulf: SilveXtru, joesatri, blissie, Rene, EscapedConvict, Mary, Nanaa, Valli, Sander

If I'm not mistaken, you cast vote # 6 - not long after, the last three musketeers followed suit and sealed his fate. There is some subjectivity with this interpretation, but in terms of momentum, vote # 6 can definitely help turn the tide. I also stated in my earlier post that it's likely at least one of the early votes was also scum.

Now, to the more important point of your stated reason(s) for voting against Radwulf:

"It's impossible to know who to trust in this game but I trusted Joe" - well so much for logic and drawing conclusions based on the facts at hand, here I was thinking that's the basis of the game's appeal:)

"I went with the logic that seemed most sound at the time and Joe has proved himself trustworthy, albeit in his death" - So while Joe himself whom you trusted confirmed Radwulf's NTA after Rad's role claim, it somehow seemed like sound logic to lynch the one player who provided confirmed evidence that he had an investigative NTA? The one scenario where this logic is in fact sound is if you're mafia/infected.

[behemoth]

Will continue to assert that we should end the day by killing the twins. The risk of Mary infecting another player is too big.

I couldn't agree more, and the mumbo jumbo that we need them around for some unknown vaccine that may or may not turn up at some indeterminate time in the near or distant future - let's just say we're better off taking our chances in killing scum now than betting our money on some cure we don't know exists or how it would even work.

[Siderite]

The talk here has transformed from "let's lynch people because they may be Mafia!" to "let's lynch people to prove that I am not Mafia!".

In all this noise we forget to even ask the ringleaders of this lynch mob: what is this all about? Because Mafia we have not yet lynched! Instead we have the @phoxes guard the henhouse, the @Princess.ruxis ask for a role then pushing everyone to lynch the security chief, the @Nonis who ask for role claims then judge them as from the tall chair of a courthouse, yet never even hinting on their own role and all of the other members of a mob that is happy to lynch as many people as possible. As Followers they move too nervous, too calm. As Loudmouths they rule too angry, too calm.

Behavior is more important than words and therefore I will "nudge" these obvious Mafia members to reveal their roles before asking others to do so.

vote Noni

[blissie]

Sorry guys, but weekends just don't work for me and the game. I'm usually to busy during the weekends, and I do not have the time required to read all the posts. I know that inactivity is a major reason for people going after me, but it is not something I can't control. Literally.

I think that we should be be a bit careful. Until now, probably we only eliminated town members and no mafia. We started probably a ratio of 28 players 19 - 9 mafia (probably one of 4 and one fraction of 5 (or 3 and 6)). And they differentiate by killing method. One is brutal: "was found with his head smashed in" and the other one "his lungs consumed by a viral infection". This clearly states there are 2 fractions. The problem right now is that if we haven't eliminated any mafia player, than the score right now is 12-9.

Today we had a lot of role declarations (most of them sound town-ish), but that is being pushed by the same persons.This is sooooo dangerous. It's like shopping season for mafia. Isn't that a bit strange? Isn't it a bit strange that Emily today suddenly is very active and very interested of knowing stuff? Also Princess.ruxi seems sooo eager to know peoples roles.

vote Princess.ruxi

[Princess.ruxi]

The talk here has transformed from "let's lynch people because they may be Mafia!" to "let's lynch people to prove that I am not Mafia!".

In all this noise we forget to even ask the ringleaders of this lynch mob: what is this all about? Because Mafia we have not yet lynched! Instead we have the @phoxes guard the henhouse, the @Princess.ruxis ask for a role then pushing everyone to lynch the security chief, the @Nonis who ask for role claims then judge them as from the tall chair of a courthouse, yet never even hinting on their own role and all of the other members of a mob that is happy to lynch as many people as possible. As Followers they move too nervous, too calm. As Loudmouths they rule too angry, too calm.

Behavior is more important than words and therefore I will "nudge" these obvious Mafia members to reveal their roles before asking others to do so.

vote Noni

Are you even reading the posts? I've revealed my role and so did Noni. You want to seem like you are contributing, but you are NOT!

[Princess.ruxi]

I think that we should be be a bit careful. Until now, probably we only eliminated town members and no mafia. We started probably a ratio of 28 players 19 - 9 mafia (probably one of 4 and one fraction of 5 (or 3 and 6)). And they differentiate by killing method. One is brutal: "was found with his head smashed in" and the other one "his lungs consumed by a viral infection". This clearly states there are 2 fractions. The problem right now is that if we haven't eliminated any mafia player, than the score right now is 12-9.

Today we had a lot of role declarations (most of them sound town-ish), but that is being pushed by the same persons.This is sooooo dangerous. It's like shopping season for mafia. Isn't that a bit strange? Isn't it a bit strange that Emily today suddenly is very active and very interested of knowing stuff? Also Princess.ruxi seems sooo eager to know peoples roles.

vote Princess.ruxi

Did you just vote me back for voting you? Mafia!

[Siderite]

The talk here has transformed from "let's lynch people because they may be Mafia!" to "let's lynch people to prove that I am not Mafia!".

...

Behavior is more important than words and therefore I will "nudge" these obvious Mafia members to reveal their roles before asking others to do so.

vote Noni

Are you even reading the posts? I've revealed my role and so did Noni. You want to seem like you are contributing, but you are NOT!

Some of you have revealed roles, but what about the others in your little cabal? And even so, how convenient to have roles that have little to no consequence. I doubt Daemon would have been so boring. And even if I would ignore that, I did reread your messages and the first thing you did was to ask for a role from Moxy then push for a lynch despite it being an important town role. You are right. It would be unfair to vote for Noni, since there is a slim chance that she is a townie, but you are clearly not. Everyone loves a witch hunt as long as it's someone else's witch being hunted.

unvote Noni
vote Princess.ruxi

[Princess.ruxi]

The talk here has transformed from "let's lynch people because they may be Mafia!" to "let's lynch people to prove that I am not Mafia!".

...

Behavior is more important than words and therefore I will "nudge" these obvious Mafia members to reveal their roles before asking others to do so.

vote Noni

Are you even reading the posts? I've revealed my role and so did Noni. You want to seem like you are contributing, but you are NOT!

Some of you have revealed roles, but what about the others in your little cabal? And even so, how convenient to have roles that have little to no consequence. I doubt Daemon would have been so boring. And even if I would ignore that, I did reread your messages and the first thing you did was to ask for a role from Moxy then push for a lynch despite it being an important town role. You are right. It would be unfair to vote for Noni, since there is a slim chance that she is a townie, but you are clearly not. Everyone loves a witch hunt as long as it's someone else's witch being hunted.

unvote Noni
vote Princess.ruxi

Again, are you reading the posts? Both Noni and I have investigative roles! What do you mean boring? And with no consequences? Who exposed Waffles?
As for Moxy, most players agreed that his posting was all over the place and suspicious. Lynching a townie is a risk on day one, since in the first day we have little to no info so you can only rely on so much - but is a risk you have to take in order to get more info.
As for those who are inactive or voting no lynch, they are suspicious. Do you happen to know any?

[blissie]

Did you just vote me back for voting you? Mafia!

No, I voted you because you are suspicions and that you bandwagon each player who is about to declare his role. I am just your latest one. And also there is the fact that I do not believe your role declaration. Can you motivate your targets?

[Siderite]

Again, are you reading the posts? Both Noni and I have investigative roles! What do you mean boring? And with no consequences? Who exposed Waffles?
As for Moxy, most players agreed that his posting was all over the place and suspicious. Lynching a townie is a risk on day one, since in the first day we have little to no info so you can only rely on so much - but is a risk you have to take in order to get more info.
As for those who are inactive or voting no lynch, they are suspicious. Do you happen to know any?

Why lynch people, then? Shouldn't you investigate instead? Funny how both of you act the same, have similar roles (that you barely use and when you do it aligns very well with already existing data) and defend each other when attacked. Also, deflecting towards "the inactive" ones seals the deal. I was wary of choosing any target without enough evidence, but to me you are clearly not innocent.

You wouldn't know as Mafia, but town people are usually inactive. It's the loud ones, who act without care or remorse, that are defined as bad by society. The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing, but men doing nothing does not make them evil.

[behemoth]

No point in starting an argument with you two, but Blissie - you sound like you inadvertently landed in our game from another game around the corner, and Siderite - you're doing a great job at playing the court jester/fool of scumish affiliation. If you would have followed anything at all about this game you would have known that if Princess does not die at the end of this day she will be the first person we instant lynch in the morning. Your behavior speaks for itself, so I propose we insta lynch at least one of them if not both, and then move on to Mary:

Found this gem of a post that Phox quoted before. Mary posted this earlier on the day when Radwulf got lynched, and then followed it up with a short and flimsy "explanation" if we can call it that before changing her vote on him.

As for you @EC, so far you have more than demonstrated that you are the one not to be trusted.
You are trying to instant lynch the one declared nurse. It makes a lot of sense to me that someone has temp checking NTA. I would expect there to be a nurse on the station. So that along with the NTA seems legit. Moxys role declaration and game play in day 1 did not seem legit, so I voted in accordance with that.

Who radwulf chose to check in night 1 is not suspicious, this is a game with lots of players, intel on any of them can prove useful. Him choosing someone new to the game is not some smoking gun. You painting it as a reason to incriminate him is very trigger happy and very suspicious.

Even without EC's revelation, but all the more because of it, the strongest evidence we have at this stage in the game points to her being mafia.

vote Mary
(this is subject to change if enough of us are onboard to insta lynch those two)

[MrWaffles]

Did you just vote me back for voting you? Mafia!

No, I voted you because you are suspicions and that you bandwagon each player who is about to declare his role. I am just your latest one. And also there is the fact that I do not believe your role declaration. Can you motivate your targets?

Hi @blissie and @Siderite,

I feel this is getting a little out of hand. Apologies for any players who already know the below in case it seems like I am saying something obvious.

I don't think Princess.ruxi is Mafia, because claiming to have a lethal infection is a very risky move. If she is lying and alive tomorrow, she will most likely get instant-lynched. Also, her power is most likely what she says it is. Otherwise, how could she know that I blocked Noni's vote on D2?

All that said, I do agree with blissie that if the entire town starts revealing roles, this may give Mafia more targets. I thought not revealing until necessary was the smarter strategy (but again, I don't know enough about this game).

-MrWaffles

[Sander]

Since Joe had food poisoning the night I targeted him and that still happened, that confirmed my idea of my doctor role. Cause the food poisoning doesn't kill, so I wouldn't hand out our precious supplies (meds).

In the bolded part, can you elaborate on what happened? I read it multiple times, and I do not understand why you thought you were the doctor at the time.

Yes I mixed up the timeline. But since I targeted him in N2, and if his death infection also happened in N2, the only explanation left, is that I got deflected. Which I - until now - had never taken into account that it could happen. Therefor I believed that the killing goes slower, and that he got targeted in N1. Because he says he could have been saved. So that means, that killing method is survivable.
And he did not survive. So either he got targeted in N1 or I got deflected in N2.

And I understand you suspect Clemens is the Godfather? In this case, if we use our NTA, he would be clean, not infected.

I’m not certain of that. But the Godfather theory is usually, everyone knows he is scum, but there is never direct evidence to prove it. Only circumstantial evidence. It’s always someone from the organization that the evidence leads to, never the godfather. In this theme, having an immune system that makes certain you never get infections nor higher temperature, would fit that concept.

Now tell me, why is it so important to you to convince everyone that there is a 2-day dying period instead of a 1-day dying period?

I’m not fixed on that. Either it’s a 2 day delay, or I got deflected in N2. And if it’s a 2 day delay, it’s extremely important to know. You know why. Because that would mean if X is the only visitor of Y in N1, and he dies in N3, you have your mafia. Whilst the mafia would very much like everyone to look at all the people of N2. So, it’s not a minor detail.

@Sander is obviously bad. Why else would he threaten to commit suicide? And say we would never get him out alive?

I would not put much focus into that. He's known for being theatrical and dramatic.
He likes to confuse and be cryptic; a trait that works well to cause distractions when you are indeed guilty.

I misread that and I thought you meant a bad player. Now I realize you mean bad as in Mafia. Well, one thing is for certain with this. It is who I am. And that means, I’m not doing it especially because I’m guilty but because I’m that kind of person. So in my case, it proves nothing. As Clemens points out as well.

As for @Sander, despite Clemens confirming his flair for dramatics, why would anyone say they're removing themselves from the game when the votes are mounting? It's like throwing all your toys out of the pram. So people feel bad, unvote and surprise surprise, there's a reason to carry on playing. Seems a bit off to me.

I understand your analogy with the throwing your toys. But your conclusion is wrong. I don’t want pity. I push people away when they get to close. The more connected people get, the harder the push. The more desperate I get, the more dramatic I act. What's more dramatic than me ending my own life instead of you. I’d preferably nicklame and start all over again. Unknown. Like a physician that moves to another town, he's always welcome.

[Emilly]

@Princess.ruxi if Mary is mafia, she's definitely not alone. So it's no problem if he lives another night. I have a hunch about her and I just want the chance to investigate her at night.

@Siderite and @blissie if they are mafia , they made a big mistake. My vote remains on bliss until he declares a role or dies.